[Bodog/Bovada/Ignition] Unofficial Thread

This thread is to separate the Bovada-related comments and questions from the Official Bodog Support Thread, which is there only for questions or concerns about anything Bodog-branded. There is no official Bovada Rep at 2+2 at this time, but perhaps if discussion is effected in a civil manner, one might arrive in due course? Thank you. MH

Edit: We've had to wait nearly 15 years, but thank you for creating a worthwhile thread that has now resulted in: by IgnitionCommunity m (https://www.twoplustwo.com/post?postId=59312998#post59312998)

Hi everyone, I work at Ignition and they are interested in providing a feedback loop for the player base here in the Ignition 2+2 thread. The idea is to help provide more transparency and answer questions you might have about the brand, product offerings, and anything else you want to know. This wouldn't be a method to answer specific user account issues due to security concer... See full post

by Unguarded m (https://www.twoplustwo.com/post?postId=58395244#post58395244)

So we have rampant RTA abuse, massive CFP stables teaching bad regs not to suck, and rakeback affiliates teaching Eastern European grinders how to game the system. Good times!

All this stuff, including the bots, isn't really a big threat to your win rate as long as you've got recreational players around. At worst, you're looking at dropping maybe 2 or 3 bb/100. The number one real threat is collusion. I don't see it much happening at the tables, because it's pretty easy to spot, report... like the classic cold call with AA and stuff. The second big issue is sharing cards, but without collusion - that's trickier to catch. These two issues are what could really hit your winrate the hardest, especially when there's more than a couple of team players at your table. And honestly, this is WAY more impactful than dealing with EU regs, RTA, bots or CFP with MDA... A quick solution would be to bring back HU tables..

by Gemaco m (https://www.twoplustwo.com/post?postId=58396324#post58396324)

I am absolutely convinced that I am being cheated on here somehow. 6 straight losing months, every single way way under EV (my all-in EV line and $ won line has been on a constant divergence .. normally it fluctuates). I don't know if its b/c people are sharing their cards so they know how what cards are folded so they can turn a slightly negative all-in to positive ones.I am... See full post

It's not just you who's thinking things like this, just read through this thread recently and even dating back to the beginning of last year. There's definitely some, maybe alot of shady sh 1t going on. After what happened with GG poker and all the people in this thread saying what they've been i wouldn't rule out the possibility of anything, including cards being able to be seen whether its players or community or both. Also wouldn't totally be shocked if the site itself is now running house bots and or is in on atleast some of whats going on in some form or fashion

hey im nasty. on global poker, i reported a bot that is starting 9max 500 games hu, i play on bovada, when i reported support almost trolled me, first responding like i had reported a problem with the fairness of rng, then they corrected and said no bots in our tourneys, and it went on like this, even though id sent them hh number of the cash game hand, didnt sound like they were going to investigate or cared.... i might be winning against this bot its really hard to say, its not very good, it does some really predictable **** a human wouldnt keep doing over and over, and the timing of each move is very similar so exact same pre, then changes a little bit post flop but its again almost exactly the same theres chance im wrong, but from 13 years playing professionally my gut tells me im not playing human, and bovada support literally give zero ****

by Karl_TheOG_Marx m (https://www.twoplustwo.com/post?postId=58396709#post58396709)

I had to Google CFP stables to figure out what that is. I'm sure these CFP owners are putting all sorts of predatory, usurious conditions on their horses. That offends me more than the resultant downgrade of the quality of these games, although that definitely sucks too.

From what I understand, CFP stables take 50-60% of the students' profits and require them to sign a contract where they have to play something crazy like 1 million hands before they can get out of the contract. I think they can buy out of the contract, but it's for something like 30-50 buy-ins at their current stake. The thought of a 21 year old college student being able to buy out their contract for 25k or whatever is laughable. I don't feel sorry for the students though. I would rather fellate farm animals for a proper bankroll than join a CFP.

Exhibit A:

This was in tonights $55 Nightly. Player 486 should be looked in to. These people can see the runouts or know the results. They all have similar stats with over 50 vpip and super low rfis. They dont know how to play poker but they know when to call all ins. This is happening far too often...Anybody has hh like this post them here and send email to report them. Wouldnt be a bad idea for us to all email when a sus hand is posted. Only way we have a chance of anything changing is us to put pressure on Bodog.

by floorsweep89 m (https://www.twoplustwo.com/post?postId=58398928#post58398928)

They all have similar stats with over 50 vpip and super low rfis. They dont know how to play poker

...we call those "fish" and I'm not even sure which one you're accusing since everyone played so badly here. 65s doesn't seem too surprising, just today I had a guy overlimp HJ and shove over my iso with 65o for 60bb. They lost to the first limper who had T8o. Anyways if 65s can see the runout wouldn't they 3bet? Or flat your 4b with the super nuts? Weird fold by 77 guy but if they could see the runout/hole cards they'd probably just not 3bet? I don't play MTTs so maybe payout structures make it a fold as played. Imo stuff like this is exactly the reason why professionals like nasty with legitimate concerns get shrugged off.

The 3b was all in less like .3 bbs . Original raiser iso raise and guy in question shoved over the iso with 65s after flatting pre. Are you drunk?

by floorsweep89 m (https://www.twoplustwo.com/post?postId=58399160#post58399160)

The 3b was all in less like .3 bbs . Original raiser iso raise and guy in question shoved over the iso with 65s after flatting pre. Are you drunk?

My bad I skimmed through it and I usually don't look at 9max ante hands. Weird your pt4 doesn't say "and is all-in".

by Nasty. m (https://www.twoplustwo.com/post?postId=58398094#post58398094)

hey im nasty. on global poker, i reported a bot that is starting 9max 500 games hu, i play on bovada, when i reported support almost trolled me, first responding like i had reported a problem with the fairness of rng, then they corrected and said no bots in our tourneys, and it went on like this, even though id sent them hh number of the cash game hand, didnt sound like they we... See full post

are there many regs in this thread or just conspiracy theorists that wna talk about bovada being rigged ect? so i just played 6 max too 500nl the same type of bot is playing those games aswell as the 9 max ones, its very noticeable when it goes heads up vs him, i dont want to list the exploits you can use vs it, but the patterns are very clear its not human, no one replied on here in 24 hours no one seems to care, or maybe we cant do anything? have any other 500 grinders noticed this strange bot ?

by Nasty. m (https://www.twoplustwo.com/post?postId=58399876#post58399876)

are there many regs in this thread or just conspiracy theorists that wna talk about bovada being rigged ect? so i just played 6 max too 500nl the same type of bot is playing those games aswell as the 9 max ones, its very noticeable when it goes heads up vs him, i dont want to list the exploits you can use vs it, but the patterns are very clear its not human, no one replied on h... See full post

It's not that. I've had a similar experience recently ITT discussing 500z and a player I'm fairly certain is botting. Nobody responded to that claim at all, afaik, but there has been discussion about 500z and 200z in general. Message boards like this are going the way of the dodo. It's such a small base of players here, and most players play much lower than 500+, and even that 500+ group is split into people that prefer 500z and those that prefer 500-2k regular tables (with which I only have mild experience, and didn't notice anything untoward, but this was 6+ months ago). I bet there are dozens or hundreds of people complaining about this stuff on Twitter. Edit: I mean, SOME of the people here ARE just "conspiracy theorists that wna talk about bovada being rigged ect", but you'll find those people in any place people are discussing online poker

by Unguarded m (https://www.twoplustwo.com/post?postId=58398189#post58398189)

From what I understand, CFP stables take 50-60% of the students' profits and require them to sign a contract where they have to play something crazy like 1 million hands before they can get out of the contract. I think they can buy out of the contract, but it's for something like 30-50 buy-ins at their current stake. The thought of a 21 year old college student being able to bu... See full post

That's somehow even worse than what my imagination was coming up with. Christ. This entire planet is built upon exploitation.

I play 200z/500z/500-2k reg on ignition for some time and can confirm there are many bots/colliders etc. it’s a known fact. The site is not acting on it yet but I’m sure they will eventually. Just be careful

by Karl_TheOG_Marx m (https://www.twoplustwo.com/post?postId=58399961#post58399961)

That's somehow even worse than what my imagination was coming up with. Christ. This entire planet is built upon exploitation.

wait until you learn how much going to college cost in the US

I commented on this about 10 months ago and all i got was a certain poster having a mental breakdown because, surprisingly, it's difficult to get lots of data in anon games. Anyone playing 1k+ - 3 handed games have been ****ed for 12-18 months, some stables show egregiously anomalous results in 3 handed games at 2k in that time period. I've reported a bunch of accounts for using gto wizard using their fairplay search but those have gotten fewer recently (I assume people just using non gtow solvers or drawing from their own pre solved db). People aren't commenting on the point too much since there's v little that you as an individual can do. The most likely way to get a result from bonition is to try and publicly shame them/harm their business in someway to encourage them to take action. The problem here is that you also run the risk of just getting banned from their platform for doing so. The people best positioned are probably the guys running stables since they have a lot of data to work with but also will have the highest risk. I can't comment on the zone games but I would assume that every format would be compromised to some degree.

by pontylad m (https://www.twoplustwo.com/post?postId=58400259#post58400259)

I commented on this about 10 months ago and all i got was a certain poster having a mental breakdown because, surprisingly, it's difficult to get lots of data in anon games. Anyone playing 1k+ - 3 handed games have been ****ed for 12-18 months, some stables show egregiously anomalous results in 3 handed games at 2k in that time period. I've reported a bunch of accounts for usin... See full post

I've seen only a few people post on the bonition forums about cheating over the past year. Those posts eventually get locked or deleted but maybe if alot more people were making those types of posts over on a regular basis there they "might" actually start taking it seriously and doing something about it instead of their usual pre determined response of "we take all accusations of cheating seriously".

by Nasty. m (https://www.twoplustwo.com/post?postId=58399876#post58399876)

are there many regs in this thread or just conspiracy theorists that wna talk about bovada being rigged ect? so i just played 6 max too 500nl the same type of bot is playing those games aswell as the 9 max ones, its very noticeable when it goes heads up vs him, i dont want to list the exploits you can use vs it, but the patterns are very clear its not human, no one replied on h... See full post

There are regs in this thread. And regs that mainly only browse this thread. You will get your riggies on every poker forum. Especially free ones! As for nobody replying. This forum is not as popular as it once was. So often times these threads don't have much activity.

by pontylad m (https://www.twoplustwo.com/post?postId=58400259#post58400259)

I commented on this about 10 months ago and all i got was a certain poster having a mental breakdown because, surprisingly, it's difficult to get lots of data in anon games. Anyone playing 1k+ - 3 handed games have been ****ed for 12-18 months, some stables show egregiously anomalous results in 3 handed games at 2k in that time period. I've reported a bunch of accounts for usin... See full post

There is minimum one player at 2k that switched from gtowiz to some other library. I spot him quite easily and I don't get hits playing with him but he is still around.

by Badreg2019 m (https://www.twoplustwo.com/post?postId=58401489#post58401489)

There is minimum one player at 2k that switched from gtowiz to some other library. I spot him quite easily and I don't get hits playing with him but he is still around.

Yeah, pretty certain I recognise the player you're talking about.

Any MTT regs still crushing here? I'm finding my winrates and overall game quality down significantly over the past months.

by skiier04 m (https://www.twoplustwo.com/post?postId=58402393#post58402393)

Any MTT regs still crushing here? I'm finding my winrates and overall game quality down significantly over the past months.

Yeah I was expecting the winter and holidays to be easier than this summer/fall, but if anything, the games were tougher. Higher % of serious players, and more people willing to stall, blind down near the bubble.

https://twitter.com/mobiuspoker/status/1... (https://twitter.com/mobiuspoker/status/1743003503755411557) This post is to raise awareness around the apparent recent spike of collusion on Ignition/Bodog. Likes and reposts are much appreciated In the past, Ignition has generally done a good job at policing games (imo) and has offered generous refunds when cheating has occurred Lately, collusion has reached what I consider to be nearly unplayable levels. No one in my network has been issued a refund despite consistently reporting blatant collusion like the examples below:

by ilovmsmorris m (https://www.twoplustwo.com/post?postId=58402820#post58402820)

Yeah I was expecting the winter and holidays to be easier than this summer/fall, but if anything, the games were tougher. Higher % of serious players, and more people willing to stall, blind down near the bubble.

Yep, exactly what I've noticed too. And ya this has usually been the softest time of the year to play in my experience. ~10,000 games played on this site @ ~30% ROI but I'm near breakeven over the past six months. Obv within the realms of possibility from a variance standpoint, but all the recent collusion posts / GG situation do have me a little extra concerned.

Yeah, while it it does look like the cash players are being cheated, I think the biggest reason that the mtt's have become so much less lucrative is a lack of new players who haven't bothered to memorize 0-30bb push/fold and 3bet ranges

Has anyone made the switch from Ignition to Bodog due to location? Are there any steps I need to take to comply with their ToS, or just create a new account? Any insight/guidance is appreciated.

by yaaasss m (https://www.twoplustwo.com/post?postId=58403836#post58403836)

Has anyone made the switch from Ignition to Bodog due to location? Are there any steps I need to take to comply with their ToS, or just create a new account? Any insight/guidance is appreciated.

You are allowed an account on each skin. As long as you've never had a Bodog account there should be no issue.

I saw this topic and have similar experiences on Ipoker skins. Made a post here: https://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/292/o... (https://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/292/online-poker-sites/ipoker-unofficial-thread-1153823/index126.html) Maybe anybody playing both skins so they can compare?

The state of micro zone games in 2024. Not sure how any human can fold that turn.

by skiier04 m (https://www.twoplustwo.com/post?postId=58402880#post58402880)

Yep, exactly what I've noticed too. And ya this has usually been the softest time of the year to play in my experience. ~10,000 games played on this site @ ~30% ROI but I'm near breakeven over the past six months. Obv within the realms of possibility from a variance standpoint, but all the recent collusion posts / GG situation do have me a little extra concerned.

Tough scene when known cheaters can't make it anymore. I have credible sources and this "approved" software was just the tip of iceberg. "urdeadpal"

by Brokenstars m (https://www.twoplustwo.com/post?postId=58402840#post58402840)

https://twitter.com/mobiuspoker/status/1... (https://twitter.com/mobiuspoker/status/1743003503755411557)

wow i was just browsing the forum and saw this, I just started playing again and while reviewing my hands over the last 2 days of sessions I found like 4 hands very similar to the example patrick posted. Not 100% sure if this is actually collusion or just a crazy hand, but of the 3 or 4 hands i have that are kinda like this, this one is the one I have the most confidence in posting.

if this is indeed collusion.. sucks to see it happening as low as 50nl fast fold lol

The bots are ~anecdotally confirmed down to 50nl, so it's possible.

just click call guys when you see these lines 3 way, it’s overwhelmingly often colluders massively overbluffing

by LordDobby m (https://www.twoplustwo.com/post?postId=58406218#post58406218)

The state of micro zone games in 2024. Not sure how any human can fold that turn. ... See full post

This is nothing. I've seen people in games like live 1/3 make folds like this while flipping up their hand to show everybody how sick they are. You overbet turn, which plenty of fish are gonna think is super value heavy (particuarly because that's how THEY form their overbet "strategy"). I'd rather have the other sets for the overbet; we block less of their continue range. I mean, your line here is certainly OK, as in, no blunder, I'm just saying. I remember the last time you posted a hand and complained about the state of the games. The hand was some complete abortion where everybody played the hand poorly. I sat there and laughed at it. Lots of actual shady **** is going on right now; your whining about some fish making a hero-fold only gets in the way of relevant discussion. (honestly, he probably just snap put you on exactly AK or AA and figured it was an easy fold -- that's how they think!)

by Xenoblade m (https://www.twoplustwo.com/post?postId=58406536#post58406536)

just click call guys when you see these lines 3 way, it’s overwhelmingly often colluders massively overbluffing

lol what, so they can get owned in all those numerous instances when there's no collusion and it's just fish being fish? Maybe you have a discerning enough eye to tell that "player 2" is colluding with "player 5" whenever they randomly meet in zone hands, but most of us do not. Your advice is only going to lead to people lighting their money on fire. I'm gonna need some special kind of cite on "overwhelmingly often".

Am I reading this correctly. did the button river a flush? why would the colluders chase away their target when they could get one more call from him?

by Karl_TheOG_Marx m (https://www.twoplustwo.com/post?postId=58406775#post58406775)

This is nothing. I've seen people in games like live 1/3 make folds like this while flipping up their hand to show everybody how sick they are. You overbet turn, which plenty of fish are gonna think is super value heavy (particuarly because that's how THEY form their overbet "strategy"). I'd rather have the other sets for the overbet; we block less of their continue range. ... See full post

Isn't this a normal fold anyways? Guy cbets multiway 3/4 then overbets turn more than geometric with so many draws possible. The paranoia is at a 10 right now

by FaceplantWizzard m (https://www.twoplustwo.com/post?postId=58406838#post58406838)

Am I reading this correctly. did the button river a flush? why would the colluders chase away their target when they could get one more call from him?... See full post

ur def reading it wrong no one had a flush, look at the hands delt to the player positions and then look at the board, i had a str8 and they rivered bottom pair with a straight blocker, two of them had str8 blockers

by Xenoblade m (https://www.twoplustwo.com/post?postId=58406536#post58406536)

just click call guys when you see these lines 3 way, it’s overwhelmingly often colluders massively overbluffing

ya thats what im thinking as well after looking at this thread and patricks twitter thread. Normally id be a little more attuned and aware of that and maybe find a call but it was a late night session and my first few sessions after a decent break

MTT's today with 104k starting stack and late reg through the 80k bb level.... lmfao

Anyone still receiving their birthday bonus these days?

by elitejaso m (https://www.twoplustwo.com/post?postId=58409114#post58409114)

Anyone still receiving their birthday bonus these days? 11 hours have passed since the end of mine and nothing.

Happy birthday.

Thanks mate appreciate it!

anyone ever made a USDT withdrawal and while it says it has been processed, you still don't have it after 4 days? all withdraws always in my ledger in no more than 24 hours (usually like 6-12hours). iggy support started by saying it has been processed. they sent me the etherscan link which doesn't show the transaction, and then finished the chat by saying that the transaction was complete and it must be an issue with my wallet... seems like classic iggy taking no responsibility but also makes no sense that it wouldn't have been received?!

by BenaBadBeat m (https://www.twoplustwo.com/post?postId=58409648#post58409648)

anyone ever made a USDT withdrawal and while it says it has been processed, you still don't have it after 4 days? all withdraws always in my ledger in no more than 24 hours (usually like 6-12hours). iggy support started by saying it has been processed. they sent me the etherscan link which doesn't show the transaction, and then finished the chat by saying that the transaction ... See full post

This thread gets more views, however technically you are posting in the wrong thread. But no matter which thread you post in, the person most likely to have been able to help you has retired from helping out around here.

Anyone still receiving their birthday bonus these days?

After talking to live chat they said: At this moment we are not offering Birthday Bonus, I'm sorry. Solid reward system 😀

by BenaBadBeat m (https://www.twoplustwo.com/post?postId=58409648#post58409648)

anyone ever made a USDT withdrawal and while it says it has been processed, you still don't have it after 4 days? all withdraws always in my ledger in no more than 24 hours (usually like 6-12hours). iggy support started by saying it has been processed. they sent me the etherscan link which doesn't show the transaction, and then finished the chat by saying that the transaction ... See full post

Maybe this is a sign you shouldn’t VPN into a site you’re not allowed to play.

by BenaBadBeat m (https://www.twoplustwo.com/post?postId=58409648#post58409648)

anyone ever made a USDT withdrawal and while it says it has been processed, you still don't have it after 4 days? all withdraws always in my ledger in no more than 24 hours (usually like 6-12hours). iggy support started by saying it has been processed. they sent me the etherscan link which doesn't show the transaction, and then finished the chat by saying that the transaction ... See full post

don’t take dirty USDT ben, take master BTC

by MicroDonkYT m (https://www.twoplustwo.com/post?postId=58409826#post58409826)

Maybe this is a sign you shouldn’t VPN into a site you’re not allowed to play.

he lives in Australia afaik

Is any way to hide de cashier balance in poker client ( Bodog )automatically when log in ? Thanks

When do sports bettors get paid their winnings on Bovada after a big sporting event? Asking so I can better anticipate which nights will have the most poker action. Thanks for any help!

by Unguarded m (https://www.twoplustwo.com/post?postId=58410675#post58410675)

When do sports bettors get paid their winnings on Bovada after a big sporting event? Asking so I can better anticipate which nights will have the most poker action. Thanks for any help!

5-10 minutes after the game. I've bet the over in MLB and got paid out by like the 8th inning when it hit.

Wow, nice! I guess that's why I noticed a surge in spew after Michigan won last night.

by MicroDonkYT m (https://www.twoplustwo.com/post?postId=58409826#post58409826)

Maybe this is a sign you shouldn’t VPN into a site you’re not allowed to play.

didn't consider this ty

a good example of what is happening constantly on iggy with the bots

by max85 m (https://www.twoplustwo.com/post?postId=58412154#post58412154)

a good example of what is happening constantly on iggy with the bots ... See full post

I see this all the time at 25nl and just chalk it up to whales being whales. What makes you say they're bots?

by newguyhere m (https://www.twoplustwo.com/post?postId=58412261#post58412261)

I see this all the time at 25nl and just chalk it up to whales being whales. What makes you say they're bots?

Let's say you were effectively two accounts playing at a table and did this... You are +EV against everything with fold equity. Either player wins it doesn't matter if it's effectively the same person/bankroll. Like, let us say hero calls... QTo and 77 are 60+% equity. It's like playing with 4 cards.

by Brokenstars m (https://www.twoplustwo.com/post?postId=58412303#post58412303)

Let's say you were effectively two accounts playing at a table and did this... You are +EV against everything with fold equity. Either player wins it doesn't matter if it's effectively the same person/bankroll. Like, let us say hero calls... QTo and 77 are 60+% equity. It's like playing with 4 cards.

Ok that makes sense. What I don't understand is why Player 5 would still call after Hero folds.

by newguyhere m (https://www.twoplustwo.com/post?postId=58412317#post58412317)

Ok that makes sense. What I don't understand is why Player 5 would still call after Hero folds.

True actually.

by Brokenstars m (https://www.twoplustwo.com/post?postId=58412303#post58412303)

Like, let us say hero calls... QTo and 77 are 60+% equity. It's like playing with 4 cards.

Risking 2 buyins to win 1 buyin...???? It's like playing with 4 cards if you also have to pay double the chips. Obviously including fold equity this will be +ev, but once they're actually called they are losing a bunch.

by Duncelanas m (https://www.twoplustwo.com/post?postId=58412600#post58412600)

Risking 2 buyins to win 1 buyin...???? It's like playing with 4 cards if you also have to pay double the chips. Obviously including fold equity this will be +ev, but once they're actually called they are losing a bunch.

I specified with fold equity... And again, even if mediocre hands call (KJ/AK/AX, other pp, etc.) between the 4 cards they have 55%+ equity. Risking 2 bi to win 3, need 66%+ equity, but they obviously have that and then some with fold equity especially in some of these other configurations. I believe it's also not uncommon for one of them to be short... So the risk/reward is often better than this. I don't know why they called though, any thoughts?

With fold equity certainly yeah, no doubt it's massively +. Though you can go some distance to combat this type of collusion by expanding your calling range. I've seen some pretty funny hhs in this exact vein recently. I can see two possibilties about the calloff - first is that it's not collusion and the guy is just a punter, which is impossible to rule out from just one suspect hh. Second is as a collusion mask at the table. If they're colluding, it doesn't really matter if they take the flip or not (excepting a few bucks in rake), but villains at the table are much more likely to write off some weird "flip" as a punter whereas backjam squeeze plays are much more likely to set off collusion alarm bells immediately. Whether this hh is collusion or not, there's a ton of strong evidence that collusion is a big problem at 500+ and I really hope iggy gets it together and works on their gamesec, though it seems a bit unlikely to be honest.

Thanks for your response.

Super unlikely that hand is any collusion. They do 3x and one of them call and backraise with JJ+ a outrageous ammount though. I haven't double checked any data but ironically it seems like they call more vs 3x opens than they do vs smaller ones. Kinda dont want to reveal too much of their strategy since clearly a lot of the cheaters/some of them read in here. And it seems like they are here to stay. It clearly aint a secret at all though that everytime a pot is multiway with two bots on the river they will make some ****ing big moves

by Badreg2019 m (https://www.twoplustwo.com/post?postId=58413761#post58413761)

Super unlikely that hand is any collusion. They do 3x and one of them call and backraise with JJ+ a outrageous ammount though. I haven't double checked any data but ironically it seems like they call more vs 3x opens than they do vs smaller ones. Kinda dont want to reveal too much of their strategy since clearly a lot of the cheaters/some of them read in here. And it seems like... See full post

I guess ultimately any reg which they both were according to session stats would not spew like this however you are right those ****ing losers who have no conscience sitting in some room with their boyfriends cheating honest people is just a really sad existence Shame the world is full of these dishonest people…..get a life

by max85 m (https://www.twoplustwo.com/post?postId=58413797#post58413797)

I guess ultimately any reg which they both were according to session stats would not spew like this however you are right those ****ing losers who have no conscience sitting in some room with their boyfriends cheating honest people is just a really sad existence Shame the world is full of these dishonest people…..get a life

Pretty sure it's a bot ring that exists on WPN as well. As other mentioned they are quite easy to spot. One thing that stands out that isn't strategical is that they never snap any decisions. It's like regardless if it has nuts or obvious calling hand vs all in they will go into the tank.

I'm no longer really concerned with showcasing some of these bot sites/rta stuff etc. since it's all just a google away these days, but reading their forums and stuff is pretty depressing.

Also examples of people using these bots on zone btw

by Brokenstars m (https://www.twoplustwo.com/post?postId=58414722#post58414722)

I'm no longer really concerned with showcasing some of these bot sites/rta stuff etc. since it's all just a google away these days, but reading their forums and stuff is pretty depressing.

Just because don't care doesn't mean others don't care. And you come off as a non-zero chance you profit from people buying this. I am reporting your post and let a mod decide. But no matter the response by Mod I think you are a moron for posting this.

I guess the botters even hate the dc/lagging on bonition.

by September.28 m (https://www.twoplustwo.com/post?postId=58414733#post58414733)

Just because don't care doesn't mean others don't care. And you come off as a non-zero chance you profit from people buying this. I am reporting your post and let a mod decide. But no matter the response by Mod I think you are a moron for posting this.

Sites need to take their security seriously. Letting it out in the open at this point is best course of action imo even if it causes short term damage. Let mod decide. I've edited the quoted msg and removed the top board fwiw. Change your quote of me if you care.

I've discussed the botting issue with people a lot in the last 4-8 weeks or so and other people have messaged me asking me about what I know (friends/former students/etc.) and many of them have sent me links to various websites/forums/RTA/ etc. voicing their concerns. The screenshots above are from an old botting forum that is very easily found and has been around for a long time and someone I know recently just sent me link to that site again (he is like the 5th person to do so in last couple months). The bots this site employ are not the "new ones" currently plaguing 200nl/500nl/1knl/2knl etc., but yeah I thought it relevant to state and provide evidence for:

1. Bovada is being actively botted and here is evidence of an active botting forum
2. Bovada Zone specifically is also being botted/can be botted Personally, I don't think it matters at this point whether or not the site(s)/links etc. to these botting sites are kept secret as the problem is primarily in getting Bonition to take their security seriously. Any person with the ability to google anything would find the same site(s). I do not think it particularly useful to keep the botting issue "under the rug" so to speak, so talking about it and admitting there is a problem is a good starting point along with actively voicing concerns and bringing the problem into the spotlight along with all the evidence. September.28 raised his concerns regarding the advertisement of such site and I gain nothing from keeping that in the ss, so I removed it which is a completely fair stance.

by September.28 m (https://www.twoplustwo.com/post?postId=58414898#post58414898)

Unscientific poll:It appear that naming bot and rta is fine in this thread. The poll how many would like me to name several names and web address? and how would like to guess at how many of those sites go up in subscribers afterwards? I'll give you guys until this time tomorrow to yes or no. If the yes wins I'll post several bot and rta in this thread 24 hours from this po... See full post

Go for it. 2p2 is a ghost town anyways. I'd be interested to see 2p2 new user numbers, but I'm guessing it's minimal. And most of the new posters are previously banned posters, multi-accounters or trolls. People post hand histories here showing suspected collusion. Those hand histories and the thread responses also show how easy it is to collude, plus give insight into player population tendencies. I don't see you bitching about that ****. And to be clear, I support those hand histories being posted. At this point, more players benefit from knowing information about the botters than the botters benefit from that same information being shared here.

I'm not projecting. You're just being a dick to a guy who was trying to share botting information with the thread. You may not agree with all of the information he shared, and that's fine. But I certainly don't believe there was anything nefarious about his posts. And I don't think he was wrong for what he shared. Again, the info is no secret. I literally typed in "online poker bot forums" into Google and found the post Broken quoted within a minute. Oh no, you've forced me to post the evidence. https://forum.warbotpoker.com/viewtopic.... (https://forum.warbotpoker.com/viewtopic.php?t=1460)

It's actually pretty enlightening to go back and read posts in this thread around july/aug of 2023.... Basically right before that post from windscreen there was actually quite a lot of relevant bot discussion and this may have been the exact forum thread he was referencing. There was a lot of the pontylad vs. ladybruin drama 1-2 days prior to windscreen's post also. A lot of the guys discussing/posting here regarding the botting/collusion were 1knl/2knl regs, but were very clearly not very active on these forums (sub 100 posts). Also the identifying characteristics they stated of the bots then (5-6 months ago) are still prevalent in the suspected bots playing in the games today.

I feel pretty confident in saying they were referring to this thread. And I didn't even review the posts from that time period before drawing that conclusion. But your post about the discussion back then makes me even more confident.

by Brokenstars m (https://www.twoplustwo.com/post?postId=58414956#post58414956)

It's actually pretty enlightening to go back and read posts in this thread around july/aug of 2023.

I'll have to check, but the dates here or earlier there is delay or lag in a product coming out and people using it actually might be very interesting for some of the Discord and Telegram rta programs that started to surface and the everyman could now purchase. It was no longer dream machines for wealthy high stakes players. So far it looks like I am posting some of this discord and Telegram rta stuff in this thread in 23 hours. So we will see if we will be marking this date in 6 months as a new influx of rta on Bodog sinceyou guys want to post these progrms in here.

by September.28 m (https://www.twoplustwo.com/post?postId=58414965#post58414965)

I'll have to check, but the dates here or earlier actually might be very interesting for some of the Discord and Telegram rta programs that started to surface and the everyman could now purchase. It was no longer dream machines for wealthy high stakes players. So far it looks like I am posting some of this discord and Telegram rta stuff in this thread in 23 hours. So we will... See full post

by September.28 m (https://www.twoplustwo.com/post?postId=56026082#post56026082)

The one and only solution is pressuring the poker site to have a bot free site. Any other approach is in my opinion stupid. You are making a huge mistake with your accepting some level of bots in the game. I cringe anytime someone asks how they can beat a bot. You can NOT.Even low stakes players have adopted the use of trackers like, Poker Tracker and Holdem Manager. Post ... See full post

It is clear that it is something you are passionate and feel strongly about evidenced by many of your old posts including the one above. I'm of the position that more information out in the open is better even if it is not really the ideal course of action. Re: your old post from 2020 is that we need to pressure these sites to increase security. I think that it is done by openly showing there is a problem and what that problem is.

These bots used to be shitty, but now that they are more sophisticated with GTO strategies and card sharing, its game over. Iggy is drawing dead, as they clearly don’t care.

by Brokenstars m (https://www.twoplustwo.com/post?postId=58414970#post58414970)

It is clear that it is something you are passionate and feel strongly about evidenced by many of your old posts including the one above. I'm of the position that more information out in the open is better even if it is not really the ideal course of action. Re: your old post from 2020 is that we need to pressure these sites to increase security. I think that it is done by openl... See full post

Dude, you went too far posting the name of the bot site. I called you out on it. You deleted it, but you deleted it acting like an *******. That is how it went down. And somehow you marshalled up some fools backing you on something you actually deleted and another person has said a Mod would suggest not be here or would delete.

by MicroDonkYT m (https://www.twoplustwo.com/post?postId=58414972#post58414972)

These bots used to be shitty, but now that they are more sophisticated with GTO strategies and card sharing, its game over. Iggy is drawing dead, as they clearly don’t care.

Yes, there is definitely some type of card sharing going on. From what I've discussed with other people, the bots specifically aren't necessarily playing GTO strats... though there are definitely real people using RTA (gtowiz for the laziest ones) and likely personal databases for specific spots like 3bp/4bp for other ones.

by September.28 m (https://www.twoplustwo.com/post?postId=58414973#post58414973)

another person has said a Mod would suggest not be here or would delete.

I said a mod would suggest what you were going to post not be posted or delete it, which was much more info than a bot site or forum. I still don't think it was some hidden information you act like it is. Anyways, I think all non-bot players are against bots. We all want the same thing. I'm tired of playing against bots, colluders and RTAers.

by Brokenstars m (https://www.twoplustwo.com/post?postId=58414956#post58414956)

It's actually pretty enlightening to go back and read posts in this thread around july/aug of 2023.... Basically right before that post from windscreen there was actually quite a lot of relevant bot discussion and this may have been the exact forum thread he was referencing. There was a lot of the pontylad vs. ladybruin drama 1-2 days prior to windscreen's post also. A lot of t... See full post

https://forum.warbotpoker.com/viewtopic.... (https://forum.warbotpoker.com/viewtopic.php?t=1460) rofl wtf. Ah yeah, Ladybruin shitting the bed when I brought it up back them. Can not wait to hear his response to that bot post about how emboldened they feel after his fukwit posting in this thread... but no doubt it will be my fault and his jocks will be all over the place. by pontylad m (https://www.twoplustwo.com/post?postId=58191223#post58191223)

That household of 50bb 1k players are back zzzz..

https://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/newre... (https://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/newreply.php?do=newreply&p=58191223) by pontylad m (https://www.twoplustwo.com/post?postId=58192502#post58192502)

Fair warning about the current 1k/2k 50bb duo. Almost always on same tables/attempting to get on to the same table. Watched both 50bbs repeatedly trying to seat swap to get ip on fish at a 2k table. Bunch of other suspicious nonsense too. Am sure it's coincidence and ignition support are all over it.

https://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/showp... (https://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/showpost.php?p=58192502&postcount=69001) by ladybruin m (https://www.twoplustwo.com/post?postId=58193383#post58193383)

I've played the top PLO games for over a decade and I use to post in this thread and be helpful on all topics but some posters like pontylad are nothing but self serving ass wipes so I stopped posting. The projecting around here has been hilarious at who shows up only when they have a problem with their specific game. Some of the cockroaches in here only come out at particul... See full post

https://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/showp... (https://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/showpost.php?p=58193383&postcount=69003) All good guys, just make it 100bbs deep and all will be solved. As I said back then this problem has been ongoing and fairly obvious to a bunch of $1k/$2k players for well over 12 months (not just August). I helped a group catch a bunch of primarily russian bots on stars back in the day and was getting told the same thing as LB by other regs. The only solution I can see to the current problem is making the issue as publicly visible as possible to "shame" (can't think of a better word) ignition security to act on the problem. That said I really don't think they care. Anyway, i won't bother responding to the obvious idiotic reply i'm going to get from LB. Thanks for the bot forum link though, I actually got a laugh out of that response.

by hunting4nemo m (https://www.twoplustwo.com/post?postId=58230234#post58230234)

Bot malfunction at 1k plo... See full post

Start of a bot discussion on AUGUST 15TH 2023. by africabrass m (https://www.twoplustwo.com/post?postId=58230600#post58230600)

Hey man, been grinding HS iggy for a few years now and can definitely ditto many of your suspicions. Here is a list of suspicious activity I have only noticed in the past 8 month timeframe:

Just one of many posts trying to have a bot discussion. by pontylad m (https://www.twoplustwo.com/post?postId=58231173#post58231173)

Ladybruin ....Last point i'm going to make...

Last point because pontylad was getting owned, but oh wait look below here comes a gimmick acccount from pontylad right in the middle of a bot discussion by ladybrewing m (https://www.twoplustwo.com/post?postId=58232132#post58232132)

Hey guys.

The creation of a gimmick account right after pontylad got owned. Pontylad derailing this thread in the middle of a bot discussion. by pontylad m (https://www.twoplustwo.com/post?postId=58232327#post58232327)

Urgh, when I said I wasn't responding to LB I meant it. ... See full post

The only gif/meme I can recall in this thread in more than 5 years right in the middle of a bot discussion. Pontylad derailing this thread. Still up my jock and writing posts about me. We are now up to AUGUST 17TH 2023. Pontylad derailed this thread for days. Days. Right in the middle of a bott discussion. by Brokenstars m (https://www.twoplustwo.com/post?postId=58414956#post58414956)

It's actually pretty enlightening to go back and read posts in this thread around july/aug of 2023.... Basically right before that post from windscreen there was actually quite a lot of relevant bot discussion and this may have been the exact forum thread he was referencing. There was a lot of the pontylad vs. ladybruin drama 1-2 days prior to windscreen's post also. A lot of t... See full post

Pontylad derailed this thread for days in the middle of a bot discussion. Awesome find. This squares perfectly with pontylad derailing a bot thread for days and the consequences being it carried over for more than just days. It became an affirmation that not much is going to get done, because even when a bot discussion starts a jock sniffing assclown is going to derail the discussion. Brokenstars, this was a great find by you, pontylad derailed that discussion 6 months ago with gimmick accounts, memes, and all arround jock sniffing assclown behaviour and the fallout is still being felt now.

The biggest issue with the new bot ring is the ammount of them, you get 2-3 on every table 24/7 and the fact that they collude with each other. I have won 7 figures on boniton mainly playing $10/20. I'm struggling these days, still winning but its incredibly tough. It went from being one of the softest/best sites to play poker to the without a doubt toughest one.

@pontylad and @ladybruin, at this point its best to just ignore each other in my opinion. by Badreg2019 m (https://www.twoplustwo.com/post?postId=58415139#post58415139)

The biggest issue with the new bot ring is the ammount of them, you get 2-3 on every table 24/7 and the fact that they collude with each other. I have won 7 figures on boniton mainly playing $10/20. I'm struggling these days, still winning but its incredibly tough. It went from being one of the softest/best sites to play poker to the without a doubt toughest one.

@Badreg, other regs have stated the same to me recently. It's clear that something became noticeably different in the games sometime Q4 2022 with many people posting about it in this thread (including myself). This unfortunately also lined up with Ontario poker leaving a bit before this time and becoming segregated, so many people attributed the "harder" games mostly to this. As time has gone on, however, many other regs came forward stating their concerns with regards to what felt like blatant collusion and at this point in time it is rampant and affecting every table and time slot. It is pretty clear to me now that there is some type of bot ring/new software and they have been slowly ramping up/adding accounts since late 2022 all through 2023. There has always been some level of cheating going on; now the amount of cheating has truly reached breaking levels.

by Brokenstars m (https://www.twoplustwo.com/post?postId=58415149#post58415149)

@pontylad and @ladybruin, at this point its best to just ignore each other in my opinion.

I haven't posted in here in awhile, however in that time the jock sniffing assclown has still reference me twice since then. I'll quote them both if you would like. You might instead want to have an intervenion and tell that jock sniffing assclown to stop derailing this thread. The implications, by your own find elsewhere are getting expensive. And I gave you props for finding that post in another site, but don't be a dumbass and post bot site names, in my opinion.

by ladybruin m (https://www.twoplustwo.com/post?postId=58415159#post58415159)

I haven't posted in here in awhile, however in that time the jock sniffing assclown has still reference me twice since then. I'll quote them both if you would like. And I gave you props for finding that post in another site, but don't be a dumbass and post bot site names, in my opinion.

You don't need to quote them. Thanks for the props. And noted.

by Brokenstars m (https://www.twoplustwo.com/post?postId=58415149#post58415149)

@pontylad and @ladybruin, at this point its best to just ignore each other in my opinion.@Badreg, other regs have stated the same to me recently. It's clear that something became noticeably different in the games sometime Q4 2022 with many people posting about it in this thread (including myself). This unfortunately also lined up with Ontario poker leaving a bit before this tim... See full post

Yeah it's quite likely it's their own bots. Bonitions security has always been bad but if someone did break the rules in a obvious way there would still be bans. Those days are over now, or at least for some. I report things 10 times per day in the forums, over email, in chat, over the phone. They couldn't care less.

I've lucked out in a sense, because my volume is very low since beginning of 2023: got a house and started a family. I still talk poker with people, but all this botting/weird stuff going on combined with a different lifestyle lead me to put in significantly less volume than I've ever done. I'm still trying to raise awareness and hopefully that will lead to some type of solution.

September.28 is one of ladybruins's accounts. ladybruin is a narcissist and a psychopath. She is controlling, possessive, disruptive, delusional and has very real mental disorders. Her posts are typically one of four types: [1] A helpful post with information to assist someone with a problem. These are rare. She seeks affirmation, she wants to be recognized as someone special. [2] Confrontational posts. She is easily triggered and will aggressively attack and name-call. This becomes an obsession. These posts are all too common. [3] Posts by alternative accounts to support "her side" and to attack the person she is fighting with. She has multiple such accounts, most that are years old. These posts are amusing and very easy to spot. [4] The "ultimatum" post. Finally, she likes to demand that the forum "pick a side." The last time she did this, she drew a line in the sand and told the forum to back her in her fight versus Pontylad or she would leave forever. (She felt the forum no longer having access to her vast knowledge would be some type of external punishment.) The vote did not go in her favor and so, true to her word, she entered self-exile never to be seen or heard of again.... until she revived one of her other accounts. She could not stay away. The urge was too strong, yet she couldn't use her ladybruin account as she had vowed not to post here anymore! Hence, September.28 become her phoenix from the flames, and the cycle began again. September.28 wanted to be helpful, yet all too soon she got triggered and become confrontational, picking fights, and demanding the forum participate in a vote of hers. The post below was a good one, where she references herself. "Tell me you're labybruin without telling me you're ladybruin" by September.28 m (https://www.twoplustwo.com/post?postId=58409695#post58409695)

This thread gets more views, however technically you are posting in the wrong thread. But no matter which thread you post in, the person most likely to have been able to help you has retired from helping out around here.

Like a true psychopath never feels remorse or admits guilt (regardless of how damming it is), she is unlikely to admit she is September.28 (or any of the other accounts she posts here with.) by ladybruin m (https://www.twoplustwo.com/post?postId=58415159#post58415159)

I haven't posted in here in awhile, however in that time the jock sniffing assclown has still reference me twice since then. I'll quote them both if you would like. You might instead want to have an intervenion and tell that jock sniffing assclown to stop derailing this thread. The implications, by your own find elsewhere are getting expensive. And I gave you props for find... See full post

Pontylad has cost you guys a lot of money.

Dang, a lot of posts deleted. Good job mods.

The bots have been starting to play $10/20 now as well. It's very alarming that not only do bonition not ban them but also somehow let them soak up more money than they already were.

by Badreg2019 m (https://www.twoplustwo.com/post?postId=58415287#post58415287)

The bots have been starting to play $10/20 now as well. It's very alarming that not only do bonition not ban them but also somehow let them soak up more money than they already were.

I wonder if traffic has gone way down since all of this went "public". I mean the attempts to raise awareness about it, Howards tweets etc. I already cashed out and i wont touch this site ever again, not only because i believe they will never fix anything about this but mostly because the same situation with ACR will happen, they will ban accounts, cheaters will create new ones, keep botting, and so on. Also, pony and bruin have to stop, nobody cares about your little drama, stop trying to have the last word on a stupid argument and shut up or go to DMs.

I found the July reference interesting because that is exactly when my downswing started from being 10/bb+ over last few years to break even over last 7 months. I don't think that is a coincidence. Something started happing in the MSNL games right around July. Whether its bots, collusion, RTA, or all of them, I am not sure but certainty there was some event that occurred. I don't think these cheaters organically appears, it seems organized to me. That's my 2 cents.

Ive posted more detailed posts in the last few months but I play exclusively 500nl reg tables and the bot/colluders are out of control. I've reported blatantly obvious hands at least a dozen times and they still here doing the most obvious ****. Bonition is outright incompetent or they in on it and def think its the former. Hmm what's that...just an aggressive reg calling a BTN 2.5x in the SB with JJ to have BB small squeeze. Standard stuff. I have a unique color code for the colluders and special strategy vs them. Its just part of the grind now, lol poker in 2024. Good news is the games are still very beatable imo - winning around ev6bb/100 on 120k hands (running nearly 2bb/100 below EV but don't think that has to do with what's going on) since about August but super annoying and ****s with your head a fair bit And guys, when you see clear collusion, especially when they sitting next to each other, like the example above, try and break the table. They seem to rly prefer this setup with deep stacks, Make them ****ing work for it

by Gemaco m (https://www.twoplustwo.com/post?postId=58415513#post58415513)

I found the July reference interesting because that is exactly when my downswing started from being 10/bb+ over last few years to break even over last 7 months. I don't think that is a coincidence. Something started happing in the MSNL games right around July. Whether its bots, collusion, RTA, or all of them, I am not sure but certainty there was some event that occurred. I... See full post

Personally I think this started in Q4 of 2022... it's just that it significantly picked up throughout the year and specifically mid of 2023... as in like 10x more accounts/frequency. I spoke with other msnl/hsnl regs and the consensus also was also that it seems organized and likely a specific group of people.

by ladybruin m (https://www.twoplustwo.com/post?postId=58415230#post58415230)

Pontylad has cost you guys a lot of money.

These side tracks are nothing to do with me. I can't repeat this enough, that other account is not me. Someone is trolling you very very hard and you take the bait hook line and sinker each time. by Brokenstars m (https://www.twoplustwo.com/post?postId=58415149#post58415149)

@pontylad and @ladybruin, at this point its best to just ignore each other in my opinion.

It's frustrating when I feel I have to respond to general lies or quotes out of context but you're right. I'll just add LB to ignore and suggest he do the same vice versa. by Brokenstars m (https://www.twoplustwo.com/post?postId=58415572#post58415572)

Personally I think this started in Q4 of 2022... it's just that it significantly picked up throughout the year and specifically mid of 2023... as in like 10x more accounts/frequency. I spoke with other msnl/hsnl regs and the consensus also was that it seems organized and likely a specific group of people.

It was definitely happening in 2022 and before Q4 but as you say not as severe. The 50 bb guys were around in Q4 but there were also 2 noticeable 100bb colluders playing in Q2/Q3 2022.

by pontylad m (https://www.twoplustwo.com/post?postId=58415593#post58415593)

These side tracks are nothing to do with me.

Your derail for days between August 15th and 17th was noticed and detailed beyond 2+2 as Brokenstars found. You cost people a lot of money with your foolishness.

here we go again, shut the **** up you 2

by Xenoblade m (https://www.twoplustwo.com/post?postId=58415664#post58415664)

here we go again, shut the **** up you 2

agreed, am done.

by staceymc m (https://www.twoplustwo.com/post?postId=58415553#post58415553)

Ive posted more detailed posts in the last few months but I play exclusively 500nl reg tables and the bot/colluders are out of control. I've reported blatantly obvious hands at least a dozen times and they still here doing the most obvious ****. Bonition is outright incompetent or they in on it and def think its the former. Hmm what's that...just an aggressive reg calling a BTN... See full post

Yeah it's incredibly how unorganic you get it in vs them preflop when they got JJ+. Like it's never like they open, 4bet and you shove on them and they call.. It's always like one of them open, you 3bet one coldcall other one 4bets or just to have one of them back4bet you. I've also had them jam aces on me couple of times which isn't a super normal human/reggy move.

What do you guys think about this? I have player 4 and 5 tagged with my colluding player tag. Table Info: Version: 1, Type: MVS, Stakes: $2.50-$5, Table: ******* Seat 1: UTG+1 ($402.13 in chips) Seat 3: UTG+2 ($167.50 in chips) Seat 4: UTG+3 ($482.06 in chips) Seat 5: Dealer ($692.50 in chips) Seat 6: Small Blind ($505.63 in chips) Seat 7: Big Blind [ME] ****** Seat 9: UTG ($353.34 in chips) Dealer : Set dealer [5] Player Info: Seat1: P1-fc91b3ab9f1fa3cc0b3caf62cc0f7c04, Seat3: P3-996ed58ee1612b6337b4a9d7460c9f95, Seat4: P4-1254c8c9494ea6c1930f135ffe87a4d6, Seat5: P5-32fd31a7c586b3f9ba2eecc0a7484719, Seat6: P6-187ea514a1a99e41ce90b4cb999ac14f, Seat9: P9-2e313447d55416d9f2bf63f7bf98b8a0 Small Blind : Small Blind $2.50 Big Blind [ME] : Big Blind $5 *** HOLE CARDS *** UTG+3 : Card dealt to a spot [Ah 2h] Dealer : Card dealt to a spot [8h 6c] Big Blind [ME] : Card dealt to a spot [9h As] UTG : Folds UTG+1 : Calls $5 UTG+2 : Folds UTG+3 : Calls $5 Dealer : Raises $22.50 to $22.50 Small Blind : Folds Big Blind [ME] : Folds UTG+1 : Calls $17.50 UTG+3 : Raises $115 to $120 Dealer : Calls $97.50 UTG+1 : Folds *** FLOP *** [7c Qh 6s] UTG+3 : All-in $362.06 Dealer : Calls $362.06 Player 8 : Table enter user Player 8 : Seat sit down Player 8 : Table deposit $150 *** TURN *** [7c Qh 6s] [3s] *** RIVER *** [7c Qh 6s 3s] [Ac] UTG+3 : Showdown [Ah Ac Qh 7c 6s] Dealer : Showdown [6s 6c Ac Qh 8h] UTG+3 : Hand result $990.12 *** SUMMARY *** Total Pot($994.12) Board [7c Qh 6s 3s Ac] Seat+1: UTG+1 Folded before the FLOP Seat+3: UTG+2 Folded before the FLOP Seat+4: UTG+3 $990.12 with [Ah 2h-Ah Ac Qh 7c 6s] Seat+5: Dealer lost with [8h 6c-6s 6c Ac Qh 8h] Seat+6: Small Blind Folded before the FLOP Seat+7: Big Blind [ME] Folded before the FLOP Seat+9: UTG Folded before the FLOP

[QUOTE=Gemaco;58416549]What do you guys think about this? I have player 4 and 5 tagged with my colluding player tag. Player 5 has reg stats 26/20/20 and had insta rebuy on - is there any justification for calling that all in on the flop? Maybe it is just over my head...

Same 2 people, same thing. One limps or over limps, another makes it 22.50, then a backraise to squeeze all the money out of the pot Table Info: Version: 1, Type: MVS, Stakes: $2.50-$5, Table: 000F08DA-0 Seat 1: UTG+3 ($342.75 in chips) Seat 2: UTG+4 ($1,167.89 in chips) Seat 3: UTG+5 ($289.18 in chips) Seat 4: Dealer ($1,915.08 in chips) Seat 5: Small Blind ($480 in chips) Seat 6: Big Blind ($500 in chips) Seat 7: UTG ($112.50 in chips) Seat 8: UTG+1 [ME] Seat 9: UTG+2 ($454.93 in chips) Dealer : Set dealer [4] Player Info: Seat1: P1-2e58fb5075cf6765a9c25fe9555d68a7, Seat2: P2-a2b399dae836438fbf2c49e756d09436, Seat3: P3-a222c2264ad2e40441e8e41d6daf8c33, Seat4: P4-5c4c2d784276226ba480f9fe9be21642, Seat5: P5-7f8a72ab67c2f6d3532fec04ab5ccaa0, Seat6: P6-e320821b771e5f478a28e234fb954950, Seat7: P7-6912591673db59a56a2f671b25a20307, Seat9: P9-ed868e048c554a2ea45a7cfffd7667e6 Small Blind : Small Blind $2.50 Big Blind : Big Blind $5 *** HOLE CARDS *** UTG+5 : Card dealt to a spot [2h 2s] Small Blind : Card dealt to a spot [6h 6s] UTG+1 [ME] : Card dealt to a spot [3h Jc] UTG : Folds UTG+1 [ME] : Folds UTG+2 : Folds UTG+3 : Calls $5 UTG+4 : Folds UTG+5 : Calls $5 Dealer : Calls $5 Small Blind : Raises $20 to $22.50 Big Blind : Calls $17.50 UTG+3 : Calls $17.50 UTG+5 : Calls $17.50 Dealer : Raises $110 to $115 Small Blind : All-in(raise) $457.50 to $480 Big Blind : Folds UTG+3 : Folds Big Blind : Table deposit $22.50 UTG+5 : All-in $266.68 Dealer : Folds Small Blind : Return uncalled portion of bet $190.82 *** FLOP *** [Qc 8d Td] *** TURN *** [Qc 8d Td] [Kd] *** RIVER *** [Qc 8d Td Kd] [9h] UTG+5 : Showdown [2s 2h Kd Qc Td] Small Blind : Showdown [6s 6h Kd Qc Td] Small Blind : Hand result $734.36 *** SUMMARY *** Total Pot($738.36) Board [Qc 8d Td Kd 9h] Seat+1: UTG+3 Folded before the FLOP Seat+2: UTG+4 Folded before the FLOP Seat+3: UTG+5 lost with [2h 2s-2s 2h Kd Qc Td] Seat+4: Dealer Folded before the FLOP Seat+5: Small Blind $734.36 with [6h 6s-6s 6h Kd Qc Td] Seat+6: Big Blind Folded before the FLOP Seat+7: UTG Folded before the FLOP Seat+8: UTG+1 [ME] Folded before the FLOP Seat+9: UTG+2 Folded before the FLOP

3 players with reg stats, 2 cold calling the MP 3 bet of UTG and probably manipulating positions to apply maximum pressure on river. I sat out table previously since P1 and p6 were playing kinda weird/in a lot of pots with each other. unfortunately I was moved from table directly after and didn't get the hh number or the raw hh data (i don't think?) Am trying to think what a legitimate reg in P1's position would cc pre and bet/call river here if they were not colluding, but can't think of much. Fun games, fun variance.

just gotta call these mother****ers down, when you're right you win 2 stacks

so many of these HH daily

by Xenoblade m (https://www.twoplustwo.com/post?postId=58417797#post58417797)

just gotta call these mother****ers down, when you're right you win 2 stacks

New GTO: never fold.

Not like they do much these days but are you guys atleast reporting these HH'S? Only thing ive ever been refunded for by them(know im playing against bots) was collusion and that was ages ago but would get refunded semi frequently. Think they never have cared about catching/stopping botters but if they're not even going after colluders anymore or are just too incompetent to catch them then it's a free for all on there. Crypto is obviously been great for people getting money on and off and not having to worry bout their banks but i don't think them offering player to player transfers was a good idea

by ALLNITSGOBROKE m (https://www.twoplustwo.com/post?postId=58418563#post58418563)

Not like they do much these days but are you guys atleast reporting these HH'S? Only thing ive ever been refunded for by them(know im playing against bots) was collusion and that was ages ago but would get refunded semi frequently. Think they never have cared about catching/stopping botters but if they're not even going after colluders anymore or are just too incompetent to cat... See full post

Yeah i reached out to them but nothing of substance in reply yet. I also reached out to their site ambassador but also crickets from him.

Played on Ignition last year and I think the competition is more interesting than any site with a European/S.American/Etc..(I don't think Uzbekistan or Luxembourg has recs) on it. A guy sucked on out on me for a $500 pot with 3 outer on the river then I just couldn't be bothered to play another hand but I would again there is nothing more juicy than someone that would do that and I don't usually see that from sober players outside of the USA. Not sure that the site cares about bots colluders. Not sure how many are there or professionals or stables or any other things but if the last time I was on there I got the 2005-2009 feeling still more than on other sites available to us Americans. Will it last: Probably not, anything that was good is not going to be good for long. The micros are probably just fine if you enjoy to have 'some fun'...

definitely lost way more during the day to these colluders but this was a highlight.

quite incredible how little they are trying to hide what they're doing.

by pontylad m (https://www.twoplustwo.com/post?postId=58417422#post58417422)

3 players with reg stats, 2 cold calling the MP 3 bet of UTG and probably manipulating positions to apply maximum pressure on river.I sat out table previously since P1 and p6 were playing kinda weird/in a lot of pots with each other. unfortunately I was moved from table directly after and didn't get the hh number or the raw hh data (i don't think?)Am trying to think what a leg... See full post

well KJo is a very very bad hand to CC a 3bet even if these guys are colluding, also player 6 doesn't represent anything on the river, even sets should protect their hand on flop or turn but still it was a weird river move, i think if they are colluding they are probably very very bad regs.

by BenaBadBeat m (https://www.twoplustwo.com/post?postId=58419421#post58419421)

definitely lost way more during the day to these colluders but this was a highlight.quite incredible how little they are trying to hide what they're doing.... See full post

same, i don't understand how overlimping Q8o its going to be profitable even if they are sharing hands against a professional player or am i wrong?

Clearly paranoia is starting to set in.

Guys, you are being delusional if you think it's nothing more than paranoia. Every semi reputable high stakes player on the site is saying the same thing, these spots aren't even close to being paranoia, hand strength is possibly not even super important in their strategy. They are probably close to +ev calling almost any 2 cards pre and applying positional pressure post flop. It just always helps when they also have blockers etc.

by BenaBadBeat m (https://www.twoplustwo.com/post?postId=58419421#post58419421)

definitely lost way more during the day to these colluders but this was a highlight.quite incredible how little they are trying to hide what they're doing.... See full post

sneaky sneaky wp here's another

[QUOTE='Darki[Per];58419449']same, i don't understand how overlimping Q8o its going to be profitable even if they are sharing hands against a professional player or am i wrong?[/QUOTE] the current form of collusion on ignition is mainly coming from pressuring people out of pots with over calls/multi way pressure rather than blockers. It’s a significantly more efficient way of cheating than say something like using rta as an individual. as ponty said, if you’re still burying your head in the sand about what’s going on on ignition, you’re very much in denial

I have emailed Iggy support again with HH and also linked this thread. The best thing we can all do is just smash support with hand histories asking them to do something. The key to getting a result is not hiding behind the keyboard but reaching out to them. Anybody is welcome to send me HH to forward if they don’t have a legit account to contact support

The irony of a dude from London, England who is presumably playing on a VPN complaining about collusion/teams is LOL 11/10 shamlessness

by tercet m (https://www.twoplustwo.com/post?postId=58420101#post58420101)

The irony of a dude from London, England who is presumably playing on a VPN complaining about collusion/teams is LOL 11/10 shamlessness

Ben loves in Australia now

no doubt he loves Australia but he also lives there I’m pretty sure

Well perhaps he did, but all of his lads knew about this site and asked me questions when I played with a bunch of them at the Hippodrome / Pokerstars casino in London back in 2015 lol

by tercet m (https://www.twoplustwo.com/post?postId=58420273#post58420273)

Well perhaps he did, but all of his lads knew about this site and asked me questions when I played with a bunch of them at the Hippodrome / Pokerstars casino in London back in 2015 lol

Oof, ok you've edited your post. I mean, what pro player didn't know about bonition or its reputation back then? or talk about it? I can confirm that Ben currently loves in Australia and is not VPN'ing.

How is it that every other page there is some nutjob posting some non sense. One could almost think you are part of the bot group and want to stear away attention from it. I have sent infinite emails to support but never got a non automated response. Got plenty of hands if someone works out a solution

by tercet m (https://www.twoplustwo.com/post?postId=58420101#post58420101)

The irony of a dude from London, England who is presumably playing on a VPN complaining about collusion/teams is LOL 11/10 shamlessness

by tercet m (https://www.twoplustwo.com/post?postId=58420273#post58420273)

Well perhaps he did, but all of his lads knew about this site and asked me questions when I played with a bunch of them at the Hippodrome / Pokerstars casino in London back in 2015 lol

not sure what your problem is. I live in aus and am therefore allowed to play on ignition. And as for 'all my lads', what does this even mean? just because i'm a brit doesn't mean i have any affiliation to anyone you spoke to at the hippo in 2015 lol. you're just projecting your frustration onto me for no good reason. i also think the biggest insult here is that you think i'd be dumb enough to post a hand here under my real alias if i was VPN'ing onto iggy lmfao

I've noticed some collusion creeping into 100nl. Had a pair at my table the other night, first time I've noticed it. But tons of cold 4betting almost always after player 6 3bets player 1 cold 4s. And if one cold called behind the other would always follow suit. And plenty of limp, small raise and after everyone in between calls the limper would always backraise big or jam. Like who over limps in the SB after 3 people limped? And then the bb makes it lol 3bb.

by Mr Spyutastic m (https://www.twoplustwo.com/post?postId=58420996#post58420996)

Like who over limps in the SB after 3 people limped? .

Can’t even log on to Bovada Mobile. Anyone else experiencing similar?

by newguyhere m (https://www.twoplustwo.com/post?postId=58421016#post58421016)

Haha I meant with a value hand like AA/KK/AK and regularly throughout the session and coincidentally everytime the bb makes some silly small raise when you have that hand you over limped with.

Another one to add to the list. p5 and p6 in a lot of pots together.

P5 goes for the the old cc/backraise with a quick snap off the A5. Obviously when looking at p4's range it's pretty easy to see what they are attempting here.

can they even win once they’re spotted? alsowhy the hell is T3s overcalling at the end lol oh wait i guess T3s is a huge whale, and A5 and 88 are the colluders

by Xenoblade m (https://www.twoplustwo.com/post?postId=58421221#post58421221)

can they even win once they’re spotted? alsowhy the hell is T3s overcalling at the end lol oh wait i guess T3s is a huge whale, and A5 and 88 are the colluders

Nothing gets past you! J/K Yeah, i was pretty suspicious before this hand, was fairly confident I was ahead here.

by Xenoblade m (https://www.twoplustwo.com/post?postId=58421221#post58421221)

can they even win once they’re spotted? alsowhy the hell is T3s overcalling at the end lol oh wait i guess T3s is a huge whale, and A5 and 88 are the colluders

99% sure, I would imagine you could play terrible and still win if you are 2/3/4 players colluding.

Two guys with very reggy stats. Could be explained away somehow I suppose as the preflop decisions aren't quite as egregious as some other hands on here, but yea very cringe, very weird, etc. I emailed support and got cookie cutter responses of course. I'm not sure I really want to keep playing here atm.

by BETHERE m (https://www.twoplustwo.com/post?postId=58421873#post58421873)

Two guys with very reggy stats. Could be explained away somehow I suppose as the preflop decisions aren't quite as egregious as some other hands on here, but yea very cringe, very weird, etc. I emailed support and got cookie cutter responses of course. I'm not sure I really want to keep playing here atm.... See full post

the only suspicious thing about that hand is the overcall on the turn with 33, then after that its a pretty decent spot to bluff raise river both ranges looks weak AF also the sizing induces to raise. but yeah suspicious but not quite as much as the others. people playing NL500 here are you suspicious on something going on at your games or just NL1k-2k?

[QUOTE='Darki[Per];58422061']the only suspicious thing about that hand is the overcall on the turn with 33, then after that its a pretty decent spot to bluff raise river both ranges looks weak AF also the sizing induces to raise. but yeah suspicious but not quite as much as the others. people playing NL500 here are you suspicious on something going on at your games or just NL1k-2k?[/QUOTE] yea i agree its not as suspicious as some of the other hands, but also why is the big blind betting 2/3 on river w A6dd?

Thats a common line even on micro stakes on iggy. They turn pairs into bluffs even muti way. There is some odd stuff going on sometimes but like i said now we are seeing paranoia about every fishy hand.

Was grinding 200nl and a giga whale was at my table. He must have donated $4000 before leaving. I won about $1500 in about 100 hands. I went to withdraw the winnings since I never keep more than 5 BI on the site at any time. I got this message: "Hello, Your account has been temporarily disabled and is currently under review. You will be contacted via email with further details once the investigation into your account has concluded. Regards, Ignition Casino Security" They were investigating chip dumping but ultimately enabled my account after 24 hours.

So what no money to be made here anymore? Good times are over lol

by BETHERE m (https://www.twoplustwo.com/post?postId=58422117#post58422117)

yea i agree its not as suspicious as some of the other hands, but also why is the big blind betting 2/3 on river w A6dd?

maybe he is just bad but yeah suspicious

by yue m (https://www.twoplustwo.com/post?postId=58422163#post58422163)

Was grinding 200nl and a giga whale was at my table. He must have donated $4000 before leaving. I won about $1500 in about 100 hands. I went to withdraw the winnings since I never keep more than 5 BI on the site at any time. I got this message: "Hello,Your account has been temporarily disabled and is currently under review. You will be contacted via email with further details o... See full post

that's standard procedure at every site when you win too much in too little time, #paranoia

I'm not even certain the 1k games are beatable at the moment (as well as collusion, game quality itself seems pretty bad). I've noticed less issues at 2k but maybe i'm missing it or they're just building their roll until can play 2k. Regardless, I'm close to being done on iggy. The site/security don't care and you can't expect players to police collusion, all it means is the obvious players get removed but the subtler ones remain.

This is the sort of example that semi flies under the radar unless you are paying close attention (bar p5 and p6 playihg/iso'ing an absurd number of pots together). I'll see what p5 and p6 had in 24 hours i guess. I think there are people colluding at nearly all 1k tables at present.

by pontylad m (https://www.twoplustwo.com/post?postId=58422331#post58422331)

I'm not even certain the 1k games are beatable at the moment (as well as collusion, game quality itself seems pretty bad). I've noticed less issues at 2k but maybe i'm missing it or they're just building their roll until can play 2k. Regardless, I'm close to being done on iggy. The site/security don't care and you can't expect players to police collusion, all it means is the ob... See full post

this IS happening at every table. 500-2k every day and every table bascially there is minimum 2 bots more like 3-4.

[QUOTE='Darki[Per];58422061']the only suspicious thing about that hand is the overcall on the turn with 33, then after that its a pretty decent spot to bluff raise river both ranges looks weak AF also the sizing induces to raise. but yeah suspicious but not quite as much as the others. people playing NL500 here are you suspicious on something going on at your games or just NL1k-2k?[/QUOTE] A6dd is kind of a perfect collusion bet 666 is one of the most likely calling hands so backraise 33 should guarantee profit

by pontylad m (https://www.twoplustwo.com/post?postId=58422331#post58422331)

I'm not even certain the 1k games are beatable at the moment (as well as collusion, game quality itself seems pretty bad). I've noticed less issues at 2k but maybe i'm missing it or they're just building their roll until can play 2k. Regardless, I'm close to being done on iggy. The site/security don't care and you can't expect players to police collusion, all it means is the ob... See full post

In 3handed games they show up with JJ+ here super often, seemingly almost never AK though. It's kinda laughable how they basically created their "own metagame". Backraising nuts, shoving AA pre, raising 100% of rivers multiway. You see it so often and it's litterally always bots doing these plays, so it makes you realise how big % of the players they are right now. It's very likely they are house bots at this point

[QUOTE='Darki[Per];58422298']that's standard procedure at every site when you win too much in too little time, #paranoia[/QUOTE] Not for GG it seems 😃

I’ve seen quite a few updates on here regarding the state of the NL games, but no updates on PLO (I know there was widespread suspicion of collusion during the latter half of 2023). I used to play 500-2k on the site as a decent winning player, but have since stopped playing those stakes due to my first hand observation of reduction in game quality, along with similar accounts from other players. I’ve recently been playing 200PLO and am getting rinsed there as well. Totally willing to accept that I am just running bad or that the game has passed me by, but interested to hear thoughts from other PLO regs before jumping to conclusions. Feel free to DM me if you want to discuss.

by SCB14 m (https://www.twoplustwo.com/post?postId=58424096#post58424096)

I’ve seen quite a few updates on here regarding the state of the NL games, but no updates on PLO (I know there was widespread suspicion of collusion during the latter half of 2023).I used to play 500-2k on the site as a decent winning player, but have since stopped playing those stakes due to my first hand observation of reduction in game quality, along with similar accounts fr... See full post

I used to play PLO at iggy too as high as 200 , so not as high as you but have noticed/suspected collusion at 100 plo after playing this stake for awhile a couple of years ago.. really bizarre lines, junk hands from multiple players trying to push me out of pots, and multiple players sitting out at the same time and leaving at the same time... as well as odd bluffs that make zero sense with multiple players in pot that is out of the ordinary. ive been playing plo for years and for the first time i strongly suspect bad faith play there at that time (even though i was beating 25 plo at a good clip, but it's 25 plo so who really cares)...so i refuse to play cash games online and stick mainly to tournaments if i do decide to tread these waters. The funny thing is, i thought i was the only one thinking this (perhaps it was just my imagination), until i started to see these types of posts on here, so just thought i'd chime in.

I'm at 25nl and sometimes 50nl on Bovada. Feels like I've only seen 1 or 2 whales in the last 3-4 days. Normally I'd get at least one with every other table I'd open.

Just curious who here has sent Ignition/Bodog support or security any problem hands re: collusion and bots and if there's been any response? It looks like WPN is really hearing the community and ridding themselves slowly but surely of these bots who could possibly be from the same crew.

by sippin_criss m (https://www.twoplustwo.com/post?postId=58427668#post58427668)

Just curious who here has sent Ignition/Bodog support or security any problem hands re: collusion and bots and if there's been any response? It looks like WPN is really hearing the community and ridding themselves slowly but surely of these bots who could possibly be from the same crew.

Yes This is the response i've been getting ( 3-4 days later) Hi xxx,

Thanks for contacting Ignition Casino Customer Service.

Thank you for bringing this to our attention, and I understand your concerns regarding the current situation at the tables. We take matters of fair play seriously, and your feedback is invaluable.

Rest assured, our security team is actively investigating reported incidents, including the specific players you mentioned. Your provided hand history screenshot and details will aid in our thorough examination of the situation.

We share your commitment to maintaining a fair and enjoyable gaming environment. While we continuously work to enhance our security measures, your vigilance is appreciated in helping us identify and address such issues.

If you encounter further instances or have additional details to share, please don't hesitate to reach out. We are dedicated to ensuring a positive experience for all our players.

Thank you for your understanding and cooperation.

Also, please review more promotions from our website on this link.

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We're available to help 24/7 if you need anything else.

Thanks,

Ignition Casino Customer Service [email]service@ignitioncasino.eu[/email] I followed up a couple of days later and og this response Hi XXX,

Thanks for contacting Ignition Casino Customer Service.

Hope your day is going great.

XXX, As part of our privacy policy, we don't discuss our findings or any details of our investigations. Our main goal is to gather as much information about any issue(s), and to forwarded it the appropriate department; they will thoroughly investigate the matter

We Thank you for your help, it’s great you alerted us to this, If you encounter further instances or have additional details to share, please don't hesitate to reach out.

We're available to help 24/7 if you need anything else.

Thanks, I decided I would check games today to see if any different... found myself getting floated by reg with 5 high, no draw in 3 bet pot on XXQQ. I have a feeling I will see another player at the table folding Qx pre but will see. Am basically done on ignition and going to withdraw until this is fixed, if it isn't I will just be playing elsewhere.

I have emailed them 3 times. Got one response from first email requesting i send hands etc, I sent, then followed up with no response. Games still same and honestly the bots are whales so im fine with playing. The only concern is collusion

What about posting in their fourms? Any mods respond there? Or do the threads just get deleted?

They've never approved my account to let me post in the forum (has been in the waiting approval stage for 5 years). It would be great if someone else could post, maybe even link to this thread.

Anyone that plays 200NL reg tables have a guess as to who the players that do these really small oddly sized 3bets IP are? Are these bots or a stable/CFP of players? They all play really similarly post flop too. Prior to like 7 months months ago, this was literally almost not a thing at 200NL. 90% of the 3bets IP were 5-15, 5-16 on btn, or sometimes smaller earlier but round numbers 5-14 or 5-13 from MP. Now, like half the people at the table 3bet 5-13.28 or 5-13.64. It is clearly not someone typing it in or scrolling the bar - its either someone using a table manager with preset bet sizes (ex: 2.65x) or its a bot. They aren't terrible to play against because they have some predictable patterns after they 3bet but its just something I noticed because every table is completely full of them now.

by Gemaco m (https://www.twoplustwo.com/post?postId=58428496#post58428496)

Anyone that plays 200NL reg tables have a guess as to who the players that do these really small oddly sized 3bets IP are? Are these bots or a stable/CFP of players? They all play really similarly post flop too.Prior to like 7 months months ago, this was literally almost not a thing at 200NL. 90% of the 3bets IP were 5-15, 5-16 on btn, or sometimes smaller earlier but round ... See full post

Don’t know but saw this posted in the WPN botfarm thread so I would keep an eye on it for sure. -they had 3-4 different SB openraise sizings like 3.13, 2.43, 3.43 etc and raising almost instantly. theres no way they using betsliders like this, or there is no way to type that fast on the keyboard.

by pontylad m (https://www.twoplustwo.com/post?postId=58427736#post58427736)

YesThis is the response i've been getting ( 3-4 days later)... See full post

Wait, you mean they didn't tell you to clear your browser cache???

by Gemaco m (https://www.twoplustwo.com/post?postId=58428496#post58428496)

Anyone that plays 200NL reg tables have a guess as to who the players that do these really small oddly sized 3bets IP are? Are these bots or a stable/CFP of players? They all play really similarly post flop too.Prior to like 7 months months ago, this was literally almost not a thing at 200NL. 90% of the 3bets IP were 5-15, 5-16 on btn, or sometimes smaller earlier but round ... See full post

I use this strategy, but not on Iggy. The population doesn’t defend well.

by Gemaco m (https://www.twoplustwo.com/post?postId=58428496#post58428496)

Anyone that plays 200NL reg tables have a guess as to who the players that do these really small oddly sized 3bets IP are? Are these bots or a stable/CFP of players? They all play really similarly post flop too.Prior to like 7 months months ago, this was literally almost not a thing at 200NL. 90% of the 3bets IP were 5-15, 5-16 on btn, or sometimes smaller earlier but round ... See full post

they are just probably using jurojin or some hotkey software

by RalphWaldoEmerson m (https://www.twoplustwo.com/post?postId=58428509#post58428509)

Don’t know but saw this posted in the WPN botfarm thread so I would keep an eye on it for sure. -they had 3-4 different SB openraise sizings like 3.13, 2.43, 3.43 etc and raising almost instantly. theres no way they using betsliders like this, or there is no way to type that fast on the keyboard.

jurojin too

by AlanBostick m (https://www.twoplustwo.com/post?postId=58428882#post58428882)

Wait, you mean they didn't tell you to clear your browser cache???

Haha, ok that did give me a chuckle.

by SCB14 m (https://www.twoplustwo.com/post?postId=58424096#post58424096)

IÂ’ve seen quite a few updates on here regarding the state of the NL games, but no updates on PLO (I know there was widespread suspicion of collusion during the latter half of 2023).I used to play 500-2k on the site as a decent winning player, but have since stopped playing those stakes due to my first hand observation of reduction in game quality, along with similar accounts f... See full post

IÂ’ve been playing the 1k-2k plos on IG since around 2016. Have always done very well, double digit bb/100 winrate. The last ~14 mo have been the most ridiculous and suspicious things IÂ’ve ever experienced in my nearly 15 year poker career. IÂ’m currently in a 200k hand break even stretch (to see how improbable this is put in 10bb/100 winrate into poker dope variance calculator and then observed 0 and run it for 200k hands. It essentially does not happen.) In fact Just today over an 1100 hand session I flopped or turned 90% equity against my opponents hand, got most or all of he money in prior to the river and lost 11 of them. Again, does not happen. ThatÂ’s not to mention the weird table hopping, ratholing, and super super slow play in hu matches. I am not the only person whoÂ’s experienced this as well. I know of 2 other big winning pros who had these massive >150k hand stretches of below 1% runs on ignition. Think the probability that there is RTA or card sharing or some other form of collusion is >80%. I really hate to quit this site because for years itÂ’s been one of the best places online to play. But it appears staying is just giving money to scammers. Might make a formal post about this elsewhere at some point but just wanted to add my .02

Isn't a viable solution to ignitions' blatant game quality issue to just have everyone have a username that only displays after downloading hhs? I think a blend of anon and non-anon is needed instead of true anon. True anon only works with a very competent and vigilant game integrity team. Would make even the "clear your browser cache" ignition support probably capable of doing something about this.

by MehAllIn m (https://www.twoplustwo.com/post?postId=58435985#post58435985)

Isn't a viable solution to ignitions' blatant game quality issue to just have everyone have a username that only displays after downloading hhs?I think a blend of anon and non-anon is needed instead of true anon. True anon only works with a very competent and vigilant game integrity team.Would make even the "clear your browser cache" ignition support probably capable of doing s... See full post

The username displaying after download seems like a great idea.

by discipulus9 m (https://www.twoplustwo.com/post?postId=58436350#post58436350)

The username displaying after download seems like a great idea.

I mean ignition could likely see a notable resurgence in players if they just had one solid update with a lot of QoL features + security measurements. When's the last time the site had a significant update? Just:

• Do the usernames in hand histories 24h later thing and actually take a small chunk of resources towards actually cleaning up games
• Try to compete with other sites a little by adding actual in-client rb that doesn't need an affiliate QoL Features:
• Betsize buttons (Am aware of jurojin and actively use it)
• Auto Top Up (What the hell site doesn't have this in 2024 holy hell)
• More table/card skins etc (I'm a sucker for cosmetics and would go nuts if there were a lot more options or in a perfect world, custom moddable cosmetics) You just do these things and the site gets infinitely better instantly, I'm not a developer by any means but these things all seem on the simpler side to do.

by MehAllIn m (https://www.twoplustwo.com/post?postId=58436420#post58436420)

I mean ignition could likely see a notable resurgence in players if they just had one solid update with a lot of QoL features + security measurements.When's the last time the site had a significant update?Just:- Do the usernames in hand histories 24h later thing and actually take a small chunk of resources towards actually cleaning up games- Try to compete with other sites a li... See full post

Only thing you said that’s worth anything is usernames 24 hours later just to help stop all the cheating, colluding, and bots. The rest are all just regular grinders wet dream requests. Bodog had and has had the best games on the internet (outside of a brief stint on Pokermaster in 2015) for over a decade. Until rather recently. And it’s precisely the things you want to see on the site that they don’t have that kept the games good.

by newguyhere m (https://www.twoplustwo.com/post?postId=58424778#post58424778)

I'm at 25nl and sometimes 50nl on Bovada. Feels like I've only seen 1 or 2 whales in the last 3-4 days. Normally I'd get at least one with every other table I'd open.

whales at 25 nl? you might need to try hunting in deeper waters, no?

by CastlesMadeASand m (https://www.twoplustwo.com/post?postId=58435877#post58435877)

IÂ’ve been playing the 1k-2k plos on IG since around 2016. Have always done very well, double digit bb/100 winrate. The last ~14 mo have been the most ridiculous and suspicious things IÂ’ve ever experienced in my nearly 15 year poker career. IÂ’m currently in a 200k hand break even stretch (to see how improbable this is put in 10bb/100 winrate into poker dope variance calcul... See full post

what value you using for PLO variance? depending on games/style/% of hu play, variance could be 160+ bb/100 or higher... in which case break-even over 200k is barely -2 SD. (and that's not even factoring in the selection-bias effect of looking backwards at a bad run.)

I've played here for well over a decade since black Friday and had a winning year every year in cash and tournaments, combine that with playing online since 2005 and I obviously couldn't tell you how many hands I've seen. My experiences the last year or so have been similar to many others here and thus have shifted the majority of my play to live cuz of what's been going on in said timeframe even though I prefer online. I'm almost at the point where I wouldn't be surprised if sadly bonition is involved in at least some of what's going on including possibly running house bots and possibly segregating long time winning regulars to go up against them. There is no way their security can be as dumb as they appear to be these days. They've lost some markets and their bottom line had to be taking a huge hit and it wouldn't shock me one bit after what I've seen personally and seeing what many other long time winning regs here have said if they maliciously decided to implement certain measures to recoup some of the capital they started to lose

by CastlesMadeASand m (https://www.twoplustwo.com/post?postId=58435877#post58435877)

IÂ’ve been playing the 1k-2k plos on IG since around 2016. Have always done very well, double digit bb/100 winrate. The last ~14 mo have been the most ridiculous and suspicious things IÂ’ve ever experienced in my nearly 15 year poker career. IÂ’m currently in a 200k hand break even stretch (to see how improbable this is put in 10bb/100 winrate into poker dope variance calcul... See full post

I stopped playing in November for the same reasons, game quality at these stakes has completely deteriorated.

Can you enter Bodog?

I can enter now. DNS stuff. 🙄

by ALLNITSGOBROKE m (https://www.twoplustwo.com/post?postId=58437752#post58437752)

I've played here for well over a decade since black Friday and had a winning year every year in cash and tournaments, combine that with playing online since 2005 and I obviously couldn't tell you how many hands I've seen. My experiences the last year or so have been similar to many others here and thus have shifted the majority of my play to live cuz of what's been going on in ... See full post

I actually think there's a decent chance player pool segregation is occurring. Will randomly be sitting 2 empty tables and then suddenly a 124.7 bb stack will get moved to my table. No other table that I can see is running and can't buy in initially for >100bb so the only logical answer is that there was another table going that they would not put me on.

by CastlesMadeASand m (https://www.twoplustwo.com/post?postId=58439583#post58439583)

I actually think there's a decent chance player pool segregation is occurring. Will randomly be sitting 2 empty tables and then suddenly a 124.7 bb stack will get moved to my table. No other table that I can see is running and can't buy in initially for >100bb so the only logical answer is that there was another table going that they would not put me on.

I experience this to a degree and I chalk it up to the software just being so bad that it doesn't queue you properly. For example I can be sitting a table alone for 30-60 seconds, and then fire up another table and be immediately sat.

See what comes of this.